From: John Krawczyk [jkraw3@comcast.net] Sent: Friday, April 12, 2002 12:17 PM To: 928 Subject: [928] CV joints - follow up (longish) Hi All, The boot replacement procedure has commenced. Last night i removed the drivers side axle assy. Turns out the both the inner and the outer boots were torn. The outer joint (wheel) was torn on the small end clamp. The inner joint (trans) was torn at the large flange end. http://members.rennlist.com/blueshark/Cv8.jpg I didnt remove the pass. side yet since all the boots are intact on that side and i dont want to risk mixing the parts. Note to Jay: Were you trying to tell me too swap the driver side axel for the passenger side axel after rehabbing all the joints? After removing the axle, which literally fell out of place after i removed all the bolts (that was fun!), I was able to just slide the whole thing out toward the rear of the car. I did not have to remove any of the exhaust components or the wheels. I took all this in the house and started to dissasemble the axle. http://members.rennlist.com/blueshark/Cv7.jpg I was able to get the circlip off the outer joint with a strange tool i had for working on GM brakes. I really need to get a retaining clip spreader, since i was not able to get the inner joint clip off with the same tool. Walmart didnt have what i needed at 10pm. After the clip was removed the whole thing slid right off. I removed the old boot and dropped the whole greasy thing into a deep plastic pan filled with undiulted simple green. http://members.rennlist.com/blueshark/Cv6.jpg After a little soaking the grease loosened up enough for me to remove the balls and cage assy. When my wife went to bed i moved the whole operation to the stainless steel kitchen sink and finished degreaseing with a scotch bright pad. http://members.rennlist.com/blueshark/Cv2.jpg Everything cleaned up good and lucky for me, no pits or scoring on the parts. I put it back together and even without grease there is no bad play. http://members.rennlist.com/blueshark/Cv1.jpg Now to the one puzzler. The boot flange has a dent in the lip probable from the axel itself. http://members.rennlist.com/blueshark/Cv3.jpg http://members.rennlist.com/blueshark/Cv4.jpg http://members.rennlist.com/blueshark/Cv5.jpg Can this be rebent back and reused or should i get new ones. This part is not listed in the Porsche Parts book i have. I guessing you have to buy the whole joint kit to get a new one. Any thoughts on this would be appreciated. John Krawczyk 1979 928 AT 63.3k Miles Chesapeake Reg. PCA 928 OC http://members.rennlist.com/blueshark > > Glen Larson wrote: > > > > > >>John, > >> > >>Can't cover all of that but... > >> > >>My flanges were pretty messed up. From what I don't know but I suspect > >>some PO was trying to bend them out to make the boots stay on better. > >>Left them alone and just clamped down the new boots. No > problems to date. > >> > >>The axles on your (our) cars are symmetrical. The joints are all the > >>same and the axles are not directional. When the joints were apart, I > >>noticed some wear on the "drive" surfaces. (The manual says that some is > >>acceptable.) Swapping sides with the axles works the other side of the > >>joint. > >> > >>Here's a tip: I had trouble getting the boots on until I stuck my hand > >>up inside the flange and worked the boot on from the inside. Then slid > >>on the boot/flange as a unit. > >> > >>Glen > >>'80 Euro S > >> > John Krawczyk wrote: > > > Hi Glen > > > > Thanks for the info. I just got done painting the axel shaft > and boot flanges an nice semi gloss > > black. > > Tommorrow i will remove the other side and do the same as i > have done already with the one. > > > > How hard was it to scrape the old gasket out of the tranaxel > and the stub axel? I got to think > > how awful the access is on the driver side. > > > > I figured out the boot on the flange trick like you did. A bit > painfull on the ole finger tips, > > but i couldnt figure out any other way to do it. > > > > So far i aint buying to this being a two hour job, I ve spent > that time just dissassembling and > > cleaning the drive side parts. Taking it off the car was the easy part! > > > > John > > '79 AT/LSD > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Glen Larson [mailto:bigdadglen@earthlink.net] > Sent: Saturday, April 13, 2002 9:04 AM > To: 928 > Subject: [928] Re: CV joints - follow up (longish) > > > > John, > > Gasket removal was easy using standard methods. (Scraper and green pad > with solvent.) > > Curious: How many gaskets are you planning on? Some say 2, manual says > 6. But it looks like 8 could be put in. Also, the keys on how to > reassemble the parts are subtle. (I just guessed on the cage.) Is there > a clear reference for this? A new site? ;) > > Sure its two hours. As long as you have a lift, no bolts are stuck and > you don't clean, inspect and repack the joints! > > Glen > From: Jay Kempf [mailto:jkempf@tds.net] Sent: Saturday, April 13, 2002 9:15 AM To: 928 Subject: [928] Re: CV joints - follow up (longish) Glen, The cage can't be screwed up. But the hub and shell can. There are only two ways to assemble them. The right way and the wrong way. If you are looking at the hub there are alternating long distances and short distances between the ball grooves. Same for the shell. there is also a groove on one side of the hub on the face. The hub face groove goes on the snap ring side. The only trick is to make sure that you assemble the hub, cage and outer shell so that the hub narrow ball groove is aligned with a corresponding wide groove in the outer shell. You have to sort of start with the hub and shell basically perpendicular to each other and then slowly bring them into final position in the same plane as you drop balls in one at a time. If you have done it right the hub will move in and out axially and angularly. If you don't it will move only angularly. Yes there are 8 places to put gaskets in. One on each of the 4 joint faces both sides. You can use form in place gasket if you want or not bother at all. It is thick grease and it doesn't leak. Sort of plugs itself when you tighten it. The gaskets are an extra caution. Probably more of a moisture incursion barrier than a grease exit barrier. You could also cut some from kraft paper gasket stock. When reinstalling make sure you reverse all the joints rotations by swapping ends on the axles. This is the only real reason to inventory parts, sides, ends although it is a good idea to keep all the parts of one joint together it is not really mandatory. Many have mixed up parts and then not had problems. Hope this all makes sense. Jay Kempf 79 US 5 speed Thinking of Graham! From: John Krawczyk [mailto:jkraw3@comcast.net] Sent: Saturday, April 13, 2002 12:50 PM To: 928 Subject: [928] Re: CV joints - follow up (longish) Opps Lemme finish that thought. > 1. Seems everyone just ignores the shop manual requirement to glue the boot > to the flange. Not nessassary from what the peeps are saying. In fact there wasnt any signs of it on the old ones. The metal parts in the boot kits i got were: 1. one large band for the large end of the boot. 2. one small flat unbended band for the small end of boot (you bend it yourself) 3. one new circlip for end of axle. I also got a 80g tube of that wonderfull Porsche gray grease with each kit. > 2. The manual only mentions one gasket per axle end, between the flange and > the joint. There may be some reason for not putting another gasket on the > outside of the joint for better contact. There are 2 per joint. the others are stuck to the mating surfaces that are still on the car, ie the stub axle and at the transaxle. 3. There is a note in the shop manual about a groove on the hub and a > groove on the joint, both being required to face the end of the axle. See this photo and note the grove on the top face of the hub and the grove around the outside of the main body, this is the end face where the circlip goes. This photo illustrates what Jay was saying in his post. http://members.rennlist.com/blueshark/Cv1.jpg > 4. The manual states as a final check of cv assembly, the hub can be pushed > back and forth over entire range of travel. What does that mean ??? In a nut shell if you put it together right it should almost want to fall apart when you pick it up since it has free rotation in all the right ways. > 5. The boot kits that I got are GKN, part number 928 332 922 01. I guess > that this is OEM, but not Porsche Original. I was ready to send them back > and get Porsche Origninal, because of warnings of boots having to be > stretched to fit, and then failing. And it looks like my boots would need a > major stretch to fit around the flange. Yet it sounds like you have trouble > fitting even the Porsche boots and that a big stretch is correct. Is that > where all the trouble is, stretching around the flange ? I probably made a bigger deal out of it that it is. Once i figured out the trick it took less than 10 sec to get it on. I'll take a pic of how it did it. > 6. Are you using blue locktite on the bolts ? (I'd love to see a general > discussion of bolts and nuts on when to use locktite, when to use anti > seize, what to do to torque values with anti seize etc.) NO (manual doesnt say anything about locktite.) John